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u/Beans186 Apr 16 '23
Faramir was quite capable and competent as a warrior and leader, despite his father's disapproval. Those are two attributes you couldn't possibly associate with RoP.
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u/Squishy-Box Apr 16 '23
The meme is more about Denethors opinion of them rather than their actual representations
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u/jver1706 Apr 16 '23
In that case it also wouldn’t be correct. In Denethors final moments he looks happy that faramir is alive (until he remembered that he was on fire) If i was dying and i saw the rings of power in my final moments I would curse the devil for not taking me sooner.
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u/A55beard Apr 16 '23
Disagree, I think this image is perfectly accurate. Rings of Power was good IMO.
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u/LordThrawn6 Apr 16 '23
Faramir showed his quality. Rings of Power did not.
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u/Boatster_McBoat Apr 16 '23
They both had a chance to do so. By all accounts only one of them took it.
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u/Dottsterisk Apr 16 '23 edited Apr 16 '23
Hard disagree.
Boromir had his failings but he showed his quality in the end. He died a hero of Gondor and a worthy man.
EDIT: Misread the comment I was responding too, but I’ll leave it up as there’s always room to remember Boromir being a hero.
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u/Nice_Sun_7018 Apr 16 '23 edited Apr 16 '23
“Both” here means RoP and Faramir - check out the comment they replied to. For most people it was pretty evident that LOTR and Boromir (especially in Denethor’s eyes) showed their quality.
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u/Dottsterisk Apr 16 '23
Oh yeah. That’s a misreading while scrolling on my part.
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u/Boatster_McBoat Apr 16 '23
All good, Boromir certainly showed his quality at the finish. No disagreement here.
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u/Nordansikt Apr 16 '23
Exactly, this meme would be much better if the amazon lotr ripoff proved itself worthy after first being (falsely) rejected by the fans.
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u/ZazzRazzamatazz Apr 16 '23
Not really- Faramir was great!
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Apr 16 '23 edited Jan 25 '24
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u/monkeyinanegligee Apr 16 '23
I think he's more specifically commenting on how Denethor felt about Faramir, not how we feel about Faramir.
Denethor hat Faramir but love Boromir LOTR fan hat RoP but love PJ's original trilogy
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u/disco-on-acid Apr 16 '23
But the reasons for hating RoP are reasonable. Denethor's feeling for Faramir are not. We understand what it's trying to say but just it's a bad comparison.
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u/grimmlingur Apr 16 '23
That was my reading as well " Rings of power is better, but unfairly not appreciated by LOTR fans"
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u/McStud717 Apr 16 '23
If Faramir was incompetent, pretentious, and motivated purely by greed and ego, then yeah this would be a great comparison.
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Apr 16 '23
No…. No…. You must just be patently evil or racist, no other explanation
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Apr 16 '23
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u/Itisnotmyname Apr 16 '23
Oh... Please... Galadriel is insufferable un this season but 'I love Ripley and Sarah Connor ' is the new "I can't be racist, I have a black friend"
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u/samisanson Apr 16 '23
They were accused of not liking strong female leads and then they referenced a strong female lead that they do like. That shows they are capable of liking strong female leads.
If someone is accused of being racist, then saying you have a black friend doesn’t mean anything because you could have a black friend and still be racist. Proving you are not racist is actually impossible unless you have a mind reader.
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u/sanguinesolitude Apr 16 '23
Oh you say you're a fan of women? Name every woman!
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u/Itisnotmyname Apr 16 '23
No. I'm saying thst you can day "this female character sucks" without use Ripley por Sarah Connor as "is not a gender issue"
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u/ts0000 Apr 16 '23
Lol, ridiculously bad take. The correct analogy here would be if someone accused you of not having any black friends and then you named your black friend. Always think before calling someone racist, otherwise, you're not helping.
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u/Gavorn Apr 16 '23
My wife liked the show. She didn't read any of the books, so she went in with a clean slate.
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u/Smaug2770 Apr 17 '23
Understandable. If you go in with no context or opinions on what Tolkien wrote or the movies, you could like it because of the cgi I guess. The big problem was that they didn’t care about the source material.
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u/TheBitcher3WildCunt Apr 20 '23
Haven’t read a single page of Tolkien and I thought it was crap. It was pretty sometimes, but very stupid.
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u/Gavorn Apr 17 '23
The source material they used was like the cliff notes version of the real source material. Tolkien estates should have just given them the rights to the Silmarillion.
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u/Smaug2770 Apr 17 '23
Honestly they should have. Quite a few of the mistakes are just because of this, but amazon shouldn’t have attempted to make a series knowing they wouldn’t get the rights the Silmarillion.
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u/Gavorn Apr 17 '23
They could have also marketed it differently. Label it a retelling or something. Or let people explicitly know it wasn't based off of the Silmarillion.
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u/samisanson Apr 16 '23
Does your wife also like reality tv shows like Floribama Shore and Too Hot To Handle?
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u/Gavorn Apr 16 '23
Are you stalking her? She also just binged Beef in one day. She is a weirdo when it comes to shows.
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Apr 16 '23
No tomb for rings of power. No long, slow sleep of death embalmed. We shall burn it, like the heathen kings of old. Bring wood and oil.
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u/Citysbeautiful Apr 16 '23
Replace Faramir with Grima Wormtounge
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u/MissKatieMaam77 Apr 16 '23 edited Apr 17 '23
Man even that guy had his moments. At least he knew when to die.
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u/Kaghei Apr 16 '23
Seeing as faramir is the closest character to Tolkien himself. Absolutely not
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u/Soggy___Bread Apr 16 '23
Not accurate haha. I wouldn’t have any love for rings of power even on my (toasty) deathbed🥵
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u/darth_orkie Apr 16 '23
No Farimir did not deserve the hate his father gave him Rings of Power deserves every bit of criticism it has gotten
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u/spartacusxx01 Apr 16 '23
The difference is that LOTR fans are correct in not liking ROP
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u/Silent-Protection-86 Apr 16 '23
By “LOTR fans” are you talking about fans of Tolkien’s novel called The Lord of the Rings or fans of the early 2000s New Line movies called The Lord of the Rings?
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u/Jojobazard Apr 16 '23
"All of them at once"
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u/Silent-Protection-86 Apr 16 '23
There is a major difference between fans of Tolkien’s novel and fans of the early 2000s New Line movies.
In my experience, most of the people who are offended by the Amazon show are fans of the early 2000s New Line movies and not fans of Tolkien’s novel.
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u/Specialist-Solid-987 Apr 16 '23
I don't know a single fan of Tolkien's written works that doesn't think Rings of Power is a crock of shit and a shameless money grab by the professor's descendents.
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u/Smaug2770 Apr 17 '23
Me too. I also don’t know any fan of the books who isn’t a fan of the movies. Of course, none of them say the movies are better, but they are some of the greatest films of all time.
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u/Silent-Protection-86 Apr 16 '23
I think there are a small amount of people like The Lord of the Rings and the early 2000s New Line movies, I just don’t think they are common as a lot of people think.
What didn’t you like about The Rings of Power?
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u/Jojobazard Apr 16 '23
1- My comment was a joke/reference to the famous dialogue between Bilbo and Gandalf at the beginning of The Hobbit 2- Absolutely disagree with you on that. I got into Tolkien through the movies, but now I am much more of a fan of the books than the movies. My movie fan side is disappointed at RoP, but my book fan side is offended. The movies change many things from the books, but they do so while still maintaining the heart present in Tolkien's work. RoP does NOT do that. Not only is it a completely different story from what Tolkien wrote, it does not feel like the legendarium.
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u/Leading-Ad1264 Apr 16 '23
I think ROP is judged too harshly. It has problems and changes some things, but especially the last episodes made me wanna watch season 2, i wanna see what they do with it.
Although i can understand criticism to an extent. It could be structured better in that it feels just like a long introduction to a story, but maybe it is just that.
What i dont get is the extreme criticism of changing stuff. The Movies changed a lot, like you said, but also really important stuff: Faramir isnt the same; the scouring of the shire is missing, which really changes the whole ending of the book and by that the feeling; Saurons eye is an actual presence, not just a metaphor …
I still love the movies tho. And it is fine if people dont like RoP, but i think one should go lightly on the „this isnt Tolkiens“ vision, because neither were the movies. They use the source to produce something new and because RoP doenst have the rights to the Silmarillion, they even have come up with the story itself. To do that right is hard, but i didnt think it failed as miserable as some people feel (which they are entitled to do ofc)
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u/spartacusxx01 Apr 17 '23
Thanks for having a nuanced opinion about both!
The point, I think, behind the harsh critique is that the LOTR movies only had three movies runtime in which they could tell the story. So they had to change stuff to make it short enough for movie adaptations.
The ROP show has almost unlimited time (what, five seasons or something?) to tell the story. So there is no good reason for them to change stuff.
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u/HotPieIsAzorAhai Apr 17 '23
LMFAO lay off the copium
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u/Silent-Protection-86 Apr 17 '23
What copium?
I’m not the one identifies as “offended by abtv show”.
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u/Smaug2770 Apr 17 '23
Of course some people who idolize Tolkien as their hero would be offended by what they see as greed destroying his legacy. I know someone who hates the Jackson films almost as much as RoP for the same reason. Maybe the creators of RoP weren’t motivated by greed, but if that’s the case then they did a terrible job of showing it.
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u/spartacusxx01 Apr 16 '23
Anyone that doesn’t like ROP is correct in not liking ROP in my opinion.
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u/MegatonDeathclaws Apr 16 '23
ROP is a mindless cash grab. I wanted it to be good but they abandoned all respect for Tolkien. Amazon doesn’t have any tegridy, fucking embarrassing.
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Apr 17 '23
Faramir could sue you for defamation for this. What an insult. For the record its more like LoTR is Sam and rop is gollum
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u/death_ray_mx Apr 16 '23
Rings of power wouldn't be a son , he would be the dog barking outside the castle
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u/heroofthewest1 Apr 16 '23
Faramir is more like the hobbit movies and I’d say Rings if power is the tomato.
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u/semaj009 Apr 16 '23
It's more like Frodo is LOTR, and Lobelia is RoP, aka a greedy incompetent money grab
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u/kaiserkulp Apr 16 '23
This is saying that RoP is stronger willed than LOTR and is a man of quality?
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u/WolfChaserr Apr 16 '23
This is a fucking stupid meme. Rings of power seemed like it was on the CW. Lord of the rings trilogy is iconic, rings of power is hard to keep attention through an episode
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u/MrKAGgerator Apr 16 '23
Faramir was the character closest to Tolkien himself. So no, nothing like RoP.
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u/MonsterPT Apr 16 '23
No.
Faramir showed valour, courage, wisdom and leadership. He was, in fact, in no way "inferior" to his brother - even though Boromir is my favourite character in LotR.
RoP has absolutely no redeeming qualities, and I mean that. I cannot believe that it cost 1 billion dollars when the production quality is this terrible. Writing, pacing, dialogue, action scenes, costumes, worldbuilding, plot, characters... it is just so awful.
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u/jesusbottomsss Apr 16 '23
RoP would NEVER ride to recapture Osgiliath despite overwhelming odds.
Seriously, I’d rather hook up with the orc modeled after serial rapist Harvey Weinstein than watch that show again.
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u/tcad_1 Apr 16 '23
bruh the truth is there will never be a good quality continuation of lotr film adaptations. I mean, look at star wars…
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u/Erock94 Apr 16 '23
Accurate. I watched RoP and don’t completely despise it, but man for the budget they had they did a piss poor job….on everything. So much potential just wasted.
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u/shifty_coder Apr 16 '23
We have to light LotR fans on fire for them to realize their love for Rings of Power?
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u/MPLoriya Apr 16 '23
Both yes and no. There was, and likely still remain, people that are critical of the LotR movies.
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u/TitanThree Apr 16 '23
I preferred LOTR of course but in the end I just loved both. Does that make me « not a fan » perhaps?
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u/Sneuoy Apr 16 '23
I may be in the minority here, but I enjoyed RoP. It showed me stories I've read dozens of times and did so in a way that kept me surprised and entertained. Hell, from the purist POV, the LOTR movies are a bit of a shitshow, but this community, and I, still love them. The show is a good time and is bringing a story that we all love to a wider audience. We should be happy about all this.
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u/DeafLizardX28 Apr 16 '23
Only because one follows lore (with a few exceptions), and the other one is a decent fan fiction.
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u/MrErnie03 Apr 16 '23
I actually enjoyed the show. Glad I waited to watch it and didn't follow along with the online community.
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u/TheGamingNerd80085 Apr 16 '23
To an extent, yes, but I’d argue The Hobbit adaptation is more hated amongst fans than the LOTR adaptation.
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u/MrFiendish Apr 16 '23
Whoever made this dumb meme doesn’t know what they are talking about. Faramir is an excellent character, and the other side of the coin when it comes to Boromir. Both noble in their own way.
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u/Consul_Panasonic Apr 17 '23
RoP is more a work of grimá wormtongue to trick us into believing its based in Tolkiens work
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u/Lethal_Drinker Apr 17 '23
Nah man that's not right, how you gonna compare the raping and pillaging of Tolkien's legacy to Faramir.
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u/Lao_xo Apr 17 '23
This is fucked up. If anything Rings of Power is Grima Wormtongue spreading his lies making us believe it would be decent.
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u/position88 Apr 16 '23
And LOTR fans fell right into the trap u/ninjanextdoorr laid out for them...
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u/imzadi_capricorn Apr 16 '23
Completely. I read some LOTR fan reactions to the movies back in the day and the troll worthy comments matched ROP. Haters gonna hate. Passions run hot for Tolkien and now we also have the benefit of identifying the racist nerds. Thanks ROP.
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u/Zargess2994 Apr 16 '23
Honestly, I hope that in a few years we will have great series with a divisive start
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u/MrNobleGas Apr 16 '23
Not at all. Faramir is judged unfairly despite being more than his brother's equal.
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Apr 16 '23
I think those who, for whatever reason, are in favour of "rings of power" need to stop playing obtuse and pretending that the entire issue is just a case of malcontent pedantics among fans. That is not true, and we all know it, even those who like rings of power know what the problem is with rings of power really. The reason for supporting it still as far as I'd discern is, as always, politics. The agendas the series attempts to spew.
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u/HotPieIsAzorAhai Apr 17 '23
There are two types of people who like RoP
The first are those who thought it was ok, or otherwise generally enjoyed it despite its many flaws. They can generally admit that it wasn't great but they enjoyed it all the same, and aren't super defensive when people criticize it.
The second are people who didn't actually enjoy RoP but pretend they do because they've hitched their wagon to it and are too weak to admit they were wrong. They get incredibly, irrationally defensive because they've made defending it part of their identity. That, or they're trolls being paid by Amazon, though those fell off quickly when the marketing campaign ended a couple of weeks after the season wrapped.
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u/ReV-84 Apr 16 '23
If Boromir represents LotR, then RoP would be more accurately depicted by the guy who picks his ear in Hobbiton.
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u/OfflineRightNow Apr 16 '23
Should be LOTR and the Hobbit as the Hobbit still has quality but is the less beloved.
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u/DSIR1 Apr 16 '23
Came to hear to say the same thing.
Don't compare Faramir to Rop, Faramir showed his quality Rop did not.
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u/sidthesciencekid14 Apr 16 '23
Nope, because Denethor does love Faramir, he just has problems. Nobody loves rings of power.
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u/kickflipthreesixty Apr 16 '23
Rings of power is a worse insult to lord of the rings than the sequel trilogy is to Star Wars
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u/blacmagick Apr 16 '23
I can't stand either, but the sequels are next level bad. At least ROP is it's own thing and doesn't shit on beloved characters from the trilogy by undoing their character arcs and achievements to prop up new characters nobody cares for.
Regardless of how bad ROP it can't be worse than the sequels because it's its own contained story that doesn't effect how we view the original trilogy, or it's characters.
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u/Janwulf Apr 16 '23
Don’t lower Faramir to the Rings of Power. The Captain of Gondor has shown his quality to be the highest. RoP is expensive LOTR cosplay at best and a money-grabbing, heartless, joyless, and soulless attempt at making something resembling LOTR at worst.
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u/Sondergame Apr 16 '23
No because Faramir actually deserved the love and respect of his father. He worked tirelessly to earn his father’s love when a father’s love isn’t something a child should have to earn.
The Rings of Power deserves nothing. It stands on the shoulders of giants and expects love and respect not for anything it has accomplished but because of what it is related to. It fails on so many fundamental levels and yet plods on because of that name. If it actually understood and respected the source material I would have welcomed it. Instead it just wants to be its own thing while wearing the name.
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u/DesignerAd2062 Apr 16 '23
Faramir was unfairly disliked in the films and underappreciated in both film and books, so yes, accurate
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u/Unlucky-Whereas-3585 Apr 16 '23
💯
ROP and its deluded fanbase drive me mad with some of things I read. I mean the whole show is a complete travesty and from what I've read about the upcoming season, it's only going to get worse.
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u/TripolarKnight Apr 16 '23
Most of the fanbase are paid shills mixed with people who defend it due to ideology more than the actual content presented. You shouldn't be mad at a bunch of orks, if I say so myself.
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u/Pap4MnkyB4by Apr 16 '23
No because Faramir is actually a great man and RoP is trash. These meme suggests that both subjects are good and viewers are just jerks, but RoP really was just trash
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u/InternationalLemon26 Apr 16 '23 edited Apr 16 '23
Nah, Denethor's issues with Faramir were unfounded.
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u/CocoajoeGaming Apr 16 '23
Na it's LOTR, and the hobbit. ROP happens to be so low beneath them, that it simply can't even be matched up with LOTR.
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u/AccomplishedPhone6 Apr 16 '23
Don’t know about RoP being Faramir. But LOTR Reddit fans are def Denethor no doubt
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u/Asuka_Rei Apr 16 '23
It would be more accurate if the top picture had lotr as gollum and RoP as a Geist from world of warcraft. I chose a Geist because it looks kind of like gollum if you squint your eyes and turn your head the right way. Geists from wow were clearly inspired by Tolkien's creation, but really have nothing to do with Tolkien and don't fit in Tolkien's stories, thus making it a perfect comparison to RoP.
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u/Silent-Protection-86 Apr 16 '23
I’m mostly just confused what message this is trying to convey.
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u/LetsGoForPlanB Apr 16 '23
This is not accurate. Faramir actually has worth. The rings of power does not.
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u/kangznquainz Apr 16 '23
No, RoP is objectively a corporate cash grab and dumpster fire, even if it had nothing to do with Tolkien's universe and characters it would still be shit
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u/Mongoose42 Apr 16 '23
Basically yes, but they would never admit it because like Denethor, they are consumed by anger and resentment.
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u/griffraff0701 Apr 16 '23
Garbage show, terrible writing, ruined lore
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u/Silent-Protection-86 Apr 16 '23
You could say the same thing about the early 2000s New Line movies.
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u/pwrmaster7 Apr 16 '23
Lololol comparing the 2 is insane. 🤣🤣
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u/Silent-Protection-86 Apr 16 '23
I agree. The New Line movies are much more lore inaccurate.
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u/Roentg3n Apr 16 '23
I thought RoP was great fun and this meme is super accurate. As a fandom y'all are so obsessed with the original trilogy being perfect you can't recognize the value of anything else being different. It's OK to not have liked it, but this fandom is ludicrously toxic and driving people away.
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u/scriv9000 Apr 16 '23
Yeah people really forget how much the movies changed and how ridiculously sketchy Tolkien's "canon" for the 2nd age is. That's why we call it adaptation...
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u/ParticularSafe6709 Apr 16 '23
This would imply that RoP actually had great quality that fans are blind to. Given how non-fans have reviewed it, I don’t think that’s the case.
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u/Magcargo64 Apr 16 '23 edited Apr 16 '23
I loved ROP, but I know that’s an unpopular opinion here. It honestly made me feel how I felt reading the books far more than the PJ Films, which felt very action movie-esque. ROP felt more poetic and high fantasy. Loved the writing loved the characters, loved the Easter eggs, and I can’t wait for S2.
Edit: I always get downvoted for just admitting that I like something :((
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u/Nacoluke Apr 16 '23
It starts with Galadriel killing a snow troll…. Alone… from your comment alone I’d genuinely think you haven’t even opened a single one of Tolkien’s books before.
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u/scriv9000 Apr 16 '23
Yeah sure which one of the 4 contradictory backstories Tolkien wrote for galadriel (which all skip millennia with her doing almost nothing) would you like see?
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u/Magcargo64 Apr 16 '23
I’ve read LOTR twice (and Fellowship an additional time because I studied it at school). Currently working my way through the Silmarallion. I’ve written quite a lot about about Tolkien and his depiction of Valinor as part of my course at uni.
I don’t claim ROP is perfect - the Numenor subplot was pretty uninteresting, and a lot of the scenes in Numenor and the Southlands seem kinda… barren? Like there are only a few dozen people on screen at once and I kinda feels like they didn’t actually hire enough extras.
But things like that aside I think it’s a very well-executed adaptation of Tolkien’s world, with some very sincere and moving moments.
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u/Nacoluke Apr 16 '23
You’re entitled to your opinion, but once again, to compare professor Tolkien’s lyrical prose with all its richness and flavor, to ROP's insipid and uninspired writing is absolutely insane to me. I too did plenty of writing on Tolkien’s work, it’s far from rare considering the prevalence of his work, it stands strong against the test of time. Enjoy the next 10 hour long season of disingenuous story telling, I guess.
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u/scriv9000 Apr 16 '23
You'd rather see finrod give a stirring rendition of that classic noldor tune 'tra la la lolly, down in the valley'?
Finrod is a philosopher first and foremost his going to say some trite stuff.
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u/Former_Ad4027 Apr 16 '23
Sincere and moving moments like Finrod telling Galadriel she has to touch the darkness to see the light, or Galadriel telling Adar that she was gonna make him watch her kill all the orcs and then kill him afterwards
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u/Magcargo64 Apr 16 '23
I actually think Finrod’s line is very Tolkeinian. The duality of good and evil is a big part of Catholic literature - we judge the strength of good by its ability to withstand the temptation of evil (compare Jesus’ temptation in the desert, with how Bilbo, Frodo and the others were tempted by the One Ring). Finrod is telling Galadriel that to understand what it means to be good she has to go up against evil and prevail.
Now, this line is repeated again at the end of series by Sauron, masquerading as Finrod in Galadriel’s memories. He misinterprets the advice, twisting it’s meaning against Galadriel, taking it to mean that you have to be willing to practise a little evil before you can be considered good - in other words, he fails to understand what Finrod’s true advice was, because he can’t comprehend being good for the sake of being good. This mirrors Sauron in the Third Age: he underestimates the hobbits, because he doesn’t think it possible that anyone would ever want to destroy the ring instead of keeping it for themself. His inability to comprehend good has always been his exploitable weakness as a villain.
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u/Feanorsmagicjewels Apr 16 '23
The fact that RoP reminds you of Tolkien gives me a feeling you haven't read Tolkien before
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u/ContactHonest2406 Apr 16 '23
I actually didn’t hate it. Hot take, I know. I thought the first three or four episodes were pretty meh, but it got better towards the end, and the finale I thought was really good. And yes, I’ve read The Silmarillion and Unfinished Tales. I don’t mind it deviated from the source. They weren’t allowed to adapt anything directly anyway.
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u/TensorForce Apr 16 '23
How dare you compare the noblest of Men to RoP? Faramir was a great man, regardless of his father's opinion.