That's some seriously old beer!

[u/XcOM987]

[u/Blackbox7719]

There are breweries in Europe with a history several times longer than that of the US.

The brewery for Spaten, for example, has a lineage first mentioned in 1397. Meanwhile, Stella Artois is the product of a brewery that first opened as a tavern in 1366 and was then purchased and renamed to the Brouwerij Artois in 1717 by its new owner Sebastien Artois.

These breweries have been around since the literal Middle Ages. Meanwhile, America’s oldest operating brewery is D.G. Yuengling and Son established in 1829 (No shade to it. It’s a good beer).

Edit: Because I’ve gotten a lot of comments about it and I can’t keep up with everyone I wanted to quickly clarify my stance. No, I do not think that the modern Spaten and Stella breweries are craft. They are, without doubt, modern “macro” breweries. By my definition, “craft” indicates brewing smaller scale, personal, batches with a focus on quality over quantity. With this in mind, I am of the opinion that those breweries were “craft” when they started out as they independently brewed quality stuff on a smaller scale. However, they were not called that at the time because the term would have been meaningless. In the Middle Ages (or before) everyone was crafting beer on that same scale and the concept of “macro” was nonexistent. So yes, the breweries I listed are not “craft” as we see the term. However, they were “craft” before the term ever needed to come into being.

[u/GCU_Problem_Child → u/Blackbox7719]

There is a brewery here in Bavaria that has been in continuous operation since 1040 AD. In fact, it is the oldest continuous operation brewery in the world.

https://www.weihenstephaner.de/en

[u/Roberto87x → u/GCU_Problem_Child]

Wow, that’s nuts. I hope they’re planning one hell of an event for their 1000 year anniversary in 16 years!

[u/js1893 → u/Roberto87x]

“1000 year anniversary” is absolutely bonkers.

[u/Ok_Wear_1725 → u/js1893]

Is it?

Yeah, I still fondly remember taking part in the 1200-year anniversary of my hometown in my youth, but it hasn't been *that* special.

I mean, most of the surrounding towns are older.
New-World-perspective is really strange from a European standpoint. Thinking of 200-year-old stuff as "old"...

[u/semper_JJ → u/Ok_Wear_1725]

In America 100 years is a long time.

In Europe 100 miles is a long journey.

[u/Ok_Wear_1725 → u/semper_JJ]

So true! We are just now carefully planning our yearly 250-mile-voyage to my parents that are living in a 300 year old building located in a 1200 year old town.

3 months beforehand. Because, well, soooo faaar away!

[u/semper_JJ → u/Ok_Wear_1725]

Yeah I always find that particular difference in thought so interesting. Everything in America is pretty young so the idea of a 1200 year old town doesn't even properly compute for me.

On the other hand we will do a 250+ mile drive for a holiday dinner, spend the night and drive back again the next day and not think it odd.

[u/Jimisdegimis89 → u/semper_JJ]

250 mile is like drive down and back in the same day so you don’t need to spend the night in a shitty bed at your in laws…

[u/Spezball → u/Jimisdegimis89]

That's just over 3 hours each way, easily do-able

[u/Barkers_eggs → u/Ok_Wear_1725]

Meanwhile here in Australia we're doing a casual 2.431km drive to go to a nice beach 2 states or provinces away.

[u/xelfer → u/Barkers_eggs]

That's only 2.4 minutes at 60km/h

[u/JinFuu → u/semper_JJ]

Me a Texan: "Oh it's only like 40 miles away, that's not too bad."

[u/ConsistentBuddy9477 → u/JinFuu]

for a very long time i had no idea how absolutely massive texas is

[u/semper_JJ → u/ConsistentBuddy9477]

Yeah its possible to wake up in the morning in Texas, pick a direction, drive all day, and still be in Texas.

[u/JinFuu → u/semper_JJ]

I remember one story my mom had was that when she went to college back in the 80s some East coasters talked about "taking a weekend trip to Big Bend." and she just laughed.

[u/JinFuu → u/ConsistentBuddy9477]

There's an Interstate road called I-10 that runs from Los Angeles, California to Jacksonville, Florida. The Western entry point of I-10 into Texas is El Paso, and the Eastern entry point is Orange.

LA to El Paso: 802 Miles/1290 KM

El Paso to Orange: 853 Miles/1373 KM

Orange to Jacksonville: 765 Miles/1231 KM

We big

[u/BocLogic → u/JinFuu]

Perth to Sydney is 2,496 miles via National Highway A1…

[u/js1893 → u/Ok_Wear_1725]

Well specifically for a business too. There really aren’t that many in the world that go back several centuries and beyond.

But yea my city just celebrated its 178th birthday since incorporating. That’s on the older side for anything not on the east coast really. It was just a trading outpost in 1800

[u/dicksilhouette → u/js1893]

This is the point I was looking for. It’s hard for nations to continue functioning for that long. For a business to go through changes of empires and governments etc etc and continue operating for that long is crazy. Multiple world wars broke out and the brewery just kept kicking. Old world or new that should be impressive. This guy just wanted to sound cool cuz his country’s old US is young so bad he was willing to diminish the accomplishment

[u/Prestigious_Rent_602 → u/Ok_Wear_1725]

My hometown was founded circa 150AD… my grandkids might get to see the 2000 year anniversary. 

Originally settled in the Mesolithic age but the current town was founded around 150. There’s a tower from 700 that you can still climb up in the middle of town. 

Another fun tidbit, Santa is buried here. 

[u/NatWu → u/Ok_Wear_1725]

You do mean "New" World settler's perspective, right? Those of us whose ancestor have been here 20,000 years have a different perspective. We had towns that were that old until the colonizers burned them (or in modern times submerged them in reservoirs built for dams).

Acoma Pueblo has been there at least 800 years. https://www.amusingplanet.com/2016/03/acoma-pueblo-oldest-continuously.html

[u/Lean___XD → u/Ok_Wear_1725]

Ah I live in a modern City, It's only 220-ish years older than USA

[u/Ok_Wear_1725 → u/Lean___XD]

Doesn't the US literally have the word "New" in a crazy lot of names?

I mean, New York, New Hampshire, New Orleans...

There is a reason for that...

[u/Lean___XD → u/Ok_Wear_1725]

We are branded as old continent, my great great grandfather's house is still standing, it has been renovated and painted pink but it's still older than most of the countries today

[u/DennistheDutchie → u/Roberto87x]

A German colleague told me he reserved a spot for 2040 already. Crazy, but sounds a lot of fun.

[u/Necessary-Dish-444 → u/Roberto87x]

Not as insane or special, but I had the opportunity of celebrating the 730 year anniversary of one of my universities. Unfortunately I don't think how healthy I will be to celebrate the 800th. lol

[u/Revolutionary_Ad932 → u/Roberto87x]

Finally a thousand years a German can be proud of!

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/GCU_Problem_Child]

What an interesting site. I didn’t even know there was a World Beer Cup. I should see if my local store carries any of their product.

[u/RunFromFaxai → u/Blackbox7719]

If it has enthusiasts, it has a tournament, no exceptions. They will be hard to find unless you fall down the rabbit hole for some niche things, but I've seen some pretty crazy championships. Customer support has championships. You sign your company up and at some points during the year testers will call in and act like a customer and score you. I once walked past a building that was hosting a typewriting championship.

Maybe you would like to join me in watching this year's Finnish Wife-Carrying championships?

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/RunFromFaxai]

Perhaps I shall. Finland has been dominating the competition for a few years now but I think the Estonians might cause an upset this year.

[u/RunFromFaxai → u/Blackbox7719]

Oh I get it, you're one of those "Taisto Miettinen is getting old"-doomsayers. We've heard all of that for years and yet he never lets Finland down. Bring your Estonian wives so they can see how a real man carries!

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/RunFromFaxai]

Look, there’s no denying the man’s impressive. Massive respect to him for all he’s done. But there’s no denying he had to switch wives just to get back on the winning streak. lol

[u/RunFromFaxai → u/Blackbox7719]

Perkele man, low blow :'(

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/RunFromFaxai]

You’re right. That might have been too soon. I’ll cheer the man on from the sidelines (while also cheering for the Estonians).

[u/RunFromFaxai → u/Blackbox7719]

Good man. I hope one day I will see you carry your wife and bring honour to your country!

[u/Sprucecaboose2 → u/RunFromFaxai]

I saw an Excel championship on ESPN 8.

[u/BarrelAged231 → u/Sprucecaboose2]

Not The Ocho!

[u/Ralath1n → u/Sprucecaboose2]

The Excel scene has sadly been dominated by the chinese market since the 16.22 patch that added localization. Makro called it back in the day, and it has panned out exactly as he predicted. Every western player in the pro excel scene now has to learn eastern macros to stay competitive...

[u/coolmike69420 → u/Blackbox7719]

Yeah, I came here to say this. I had some friends go to the brewery on their honeymoon and I guess they’ve already began working on their 1000 year anniversary celebration.

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/coolmike69420]

Man, imagine that. A thousand years of making beer.

[u/realnzall → u/Blackbox7719]

Imagine that. You've been pursuing the art of the perfect beer for centuries, to the point that you've won several worldwide awards and are preparing for your thousand year anniversary. Your brewery is older than most COUNTRIES. Entire empires have risen and fallen during the lifetime of your brewery. Your brewery is so old that it is possible people on the First Crusade brought your beer with them to the Holy Land.

And then some bloviating rascal probably not even old enough to drink yet in his home country, a crime infested ostensibly developed country with outsized importance due to the willingness of leadership to sacrifice its youth to fight wars in areas they can't even mark on a map, tries to claim that their pale imitation craft beer is better than yours and calls your beer weak.

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/realnzall]

It is rather funny when you think about it. Though, I will say, America does have some excellent modern breweries as well. I frankly don’t understand why people fight about it. We should all be friends and enjoy each other’s beer together. That’s the spirit of beer if you ask me.

[u/twonaq → u/Blackbox7719]

I once heard a song that really resonated with me, I think it fits here.

“More beer, more beer, more beer, more beer”

[u/Ambitious-Win-9408 → u/realnzall]

Poetry.

[u/Hefty-Profession-567 → u/GCU_Problem_Child]

The Hefeweizen is superb

[u/deednait → u/Hefty-Profession-567]

The local grocery store sells it here in Finland. Hard to pass that shelf without picking one up.

[u/grease_maynard → u/deednait]

They sell it in grocery stores in the US too, just bought some the other day(Ohio)

[u/Automatic_Chemist161 → u/Hefty-Profession-567]

The best weizen I've ever had was Weihenstephaner on their sunny 30 degree terrace. Glad I took the detour while driving to MUC airport!

[u/XcOM987 → u/GCU_Problem_Child]

I was in Bavaria the other week and actually had their beer for the first time, was damm nice beer!

[u/_Apatosaurus_ → u/XcOM987]

I was in Bavaria the other week and actually had their beer for the first time

Not surprising. Beer is pretty new to Bavaria. I'm guessing they saw the success of American microbreweries and are trying to model their own beer after it. It will be cool to see what kind of beer Bavaria makes after a few years discovering their niche in the beer world.

[u/last-guys-alternate → u/_Apatosaurus_]

Nah, it'll never catch on there. Beer just isn't compatible with the Bavarian culture and way of life. They're about as likely to adopt American inventions like sausage and sauerkraut as they are beer.

What next? Neopolitans getting into pizza?

[u/WOOWOHOOH → u/XcOM987]

One of my local craft bars serves it on tap as their "basic beer". Funny how exceptional it actually is.

[u/Giveadont → u/GCU_Problem_Child]

Their stuff is amazing. The Dunkel they make is probably one of my favorite beers.

[u/UncommonHouseSpider → u/GCU_Problem_Child]

Goes to show a good beer never goes out of style!

[u/ChEChicago → u/GCU_Problem_Child]

Also, weihenstephaner hefeweizen (and hefeweizens in general) are fucking awesome

[u/Tazilyna-Taxaro → u/Blackbox7719]

The German Reinheitsgebot (degree of purity for beer; first law about food safety) is from 1517 and therefore older than the USA - by over 250 years!!!

We had laws about craft beer before the USA were founded.

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/Tazilyna-Taxaro]

All I’m gonna say is that there is a good reason going to Germany is likely to be a danger to my life. I’m not sure I’d end up sober long enough to remember I have to go home. Lol

[u/OkCar7264 → u/Blackbox7719]

I mean hitting up a German biergarten sounds amazing but Belgium is where I want to die of beer poisoning.

[u/AlmightyWorldEater → u/Blackbox7719]

Come to my region, we have highest density of breweries in the world. Awesome small ones in every second village in some areas.

Can't guarantee your survival, but you will have one hell of a time indeed!

[u/Who_am_ey3 → u/Tazilyna-Taxaro]

funnily enough, the US has been a country way longer than Germany has been one

[u/Defacticool → u/Who_am_ey3]

Well no it's been a state (polity state, not subdivision state) for longer.

The country of germany existed prior to the creation of a german state.

Same with italy as mentioned below.

In the year 1650 (or whenever) people would still call, say, berlin "in germany".

There just wasn't a unified state over the entire country as of yet.

Hell the HRE was at points called the german empire

[u/MartyBarrett → u/Blackbox7719]

Bullshit, everyone knows German band Kraftwerk invented Kraft beer in the 1970s.

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/MartyBarrett]

My friend has a vinyl with some of their songs. Lol

[u/tessartyp → u/MartyBarrett]

They invented American Cheese!

[u/sputnikmonolith → u/Blackbox7719]

Haha, fuck sake - this blew up. I was just trying to be facetious because the guy sounded like one of those craft beer wankers.

I actually don't know anything about brewing.

Know plenty about drinking though.

[u/JollyGiantLippstadt → u/Blackbox7719]

Weihenstephan Brewery is dated back to 1040. Weltenburger Kloster Brewery 1050. Bolten Brewery 1266. (All dated by documents, but even older). And that are only a few Breweries. I am pretty sure that there are similarly old and documented breweries in Belgium, the Netherlands and other European countries. And I won't even start on the fact that beer originated in the Fertile Crescent (Arabian region). However, it should also be mentioned that the craft beer wave unleashed by American breweries has ensured that unusual hop varieties have become widespread. However, this is by no means the work of large American breweries. (BTW, never ask the Anhaeuser Busch brewery why their beer is named Budweiser).

[u/howarewestillhere → u/Blackbox7719]

One of my favorites is the Strahov Monastery Brewery at the top of the Prague Castle complex. They’ve been brewing beer for over 600 years.

Pro tip: Prague Castle is an all day excursion, and most people start out at the famous castle steps at the bottom of the hill, making it a full day of walking up hill. Instead, take the #22 tram to the top of the hill, where the Monastery is, and walk down the hill all day. They open and start serving beer and breakfast at 10am. Don’t miss the very odd Museum of Miniatures nearby.

[u/flepke → u/Blackbox7719]

Yuengling sounds like an authentic American name

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/flepke]

The founder was actually a German immigrant (no surprise) named David Gottlieb Jüngling and the brewery is an anglicized version of that last name.

[u/flepke → u/Blackbox7719]

So real Americans making craft beer is just a recent hype? takes a sip from my Belgian craft beer

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/flepke]

I guess it really depends on what you consider a “real” American. Most Americans are the descendants of immigrants and most of the American breweries (craft especially) that I’m aware of tend to be located in places known for being centers of German immigration.

The Boston Beer Company (produces Sam Adams Lager) is one of the big breweries that I’d consider full on “American.” Its founder, James Koch, is considered to be an influential figure in America’s craft brewing movement. No surprise, the man was born to German-American parents and the family had brewers going back several generations.

In essence, American brewing has strong roots in European tradition but is steadily growing on its own. Some of my local breweries produce absolutely great stuff.

[u/CrazyPlato → u/flepke]

Adding to the conversation, what do we even mean by “craft beer”? The only real definition there is beer that isn’t mass-produced (compared to, say, Bud Light, which is made in a largely industrialized and standardized process for more efficient production on larger scales).

Like, people keep saying “craft beer” to mean “good beer”, or at least “beer that isn’t beer that I dislike”. But OOP’s just revealing that they know practically nothing about beer.

[u/Powerful_Baseball_55 → u/flepke]

Too many foreigners in America! What!🤠

[u/Wafkak → u/Blackbox7719]

Even just the percentages, we have old beers of 10% in Belgium.

[u/transmothra → u/Blackbox7719]

Yuengling is tasty*, but for those who care where their money goes, the company and its owners are known to support right-wing politicians, including Trump.

* in comparison to average grocery-store shitbeers like Coors or Budweiser

[u/Blackbox7719 → u/transmothra]

Interesting. I’m definitely not against people voting with their wallet though, I will say, these days it hard to buy anything without at least some of the money going to places one might not want. Hell, just trying to avoid Nestle will cut out a third of a store’s available product.

[u/Suitable-Peanut → u/transmothra]

It's also definitely not tasty in the opinion of most craft beer drinkers, including myself.

[u/Acrobatic-Initial911 → u/Blackbox7719]

Could name a lot more breweries

[u/Hrtzy → u/Blackbox7719]

And as for the idea of brewing as a craft, it is hypothesised to have been the impetus for inventing civilization.

[u/cuboidofficial → u/Blackbox7719]

Späten is such a damn good beer too. Not surprised theyve been around for so damn long

[u/ebrum2010 → u/Blackbox7719]

These aren't craft breweries though. The craft brewery movement dates only to the 1970s. I'm pretty sure the US has been around longer than the 1970s.

[u/[deleted] → u/Blackbox7719]

And none of those are craft breweries...

[u/DreamArcher → u/Blackbox7719]

Friendly comment incoming: Craft beer is made in a traditional way but I think the modern usage of the term is a small independent brewer. No argument there are very old European breweries but do they fit the modern definition? The disparity here might simply be over what someone thinks a craft brewery is.

[u/MasterMacMan → u/Blackbox7719]

It really depends on how you define “craft” breweries, or connect the lineages. I don’t think most people would call Stella or Yuengling craft beer.

[u/[deleted]]

Ten thousand years or so ago, when it was invented, wasn't all beer "craft beer"?

[u/TivRed → u/[deleted]]

Nah, the original beers were in chain pubs. 🤣🤣

[u/Lone_Wanderer97 → u/TivRed]

Ye Olde Dave n Busters

[u/Haxorz7125 → u/Lone_Wanderer97]

The dark ages

[u/Curiouspiwaiwaka → u/TivRed]

Exactly. I've been down enough bloody city boy chain pubs with their logos in the foam and disinfectant in the lager, air freshener in the mayo.

[u/AdSignificant6748 → u/[deleted]]

No first came the canned heinekens

[u/Jeffy29 → u/AdSignificant6748]

Ĺife back then was truly though and miserable

[u/Gowpenny → u/[deleted]]

Indigenous Australians were fermenting tree sap and making a type of cider. It’s called way-a-linah. So alcohol has existed in some form here for about 40k+ years.

[u/BonnieMcMurray → u/Gowpenny]

Drunk deer enter the chat...

Humans didn't invent alcohol consumption. Berries have been fermenting naturally in the wild for tens of millions of years.

[u/caylem00 → u/BonnieMcMurray]

But they did invent intentional fermentation. 

Also no deer in Aus. Drunk kangaroos would be hilarious, though. Ever looked up what happens when wallabies (smaller cousins to roos) get into opium crops?

[u/TheMainEffort → u/[deleted]]

You likely get to saying America invented craft beer with a very narrow definition of craft beer. Find an American brewery that was the first to do literally anything, include it in your definition.

[u/ProfessorWednesday → u/[deleted]]

American breweries invented the need for the distinction of "craft" beer so we deserve at least some credit

[u/foxy-coxy]

I guarantee that your country's beers are weaker than the average craft beer.

::Laughs in Belgian::

[u/Hoybom → u/foxy-coxy]

Agrees in German "Bock" beer

[u/friftar → u/Hoybom]

Some good Doppelbock never fails to absolutely mess you up unless you know what to expect. Usually tastes fairly tame too, so it's great to hand one to tourists and watch them get absolutely wrecked before they even finish their second one.

In terms of absolute fuck-up-factor I have to hand it to the Danes though, the Faxe in the black 1 liter can may not taste all that great, but boy will you get hammer smashed faced from that stuff. I call it headache in a can.

[u/CLG91 → u/foxy-coxy]

Background chuckle intensifies, in Scottish.

[u/artfuldodger1212 → u/CLG91]

I live in Scotland and have no idea what you are talking about. Our beer is generally pretty weak when it comes to ABV. Usually around 4%. Even cask ales are generally in that range. Nothing like beers in most of Europe or even American IPA style beers which do tend to be stronger.

[u/encinaloak → u/artfuldodger1212]

Wee Heavy, Traquair House.

[u/sputnikmonolith → u/foxy-coxy]

Love Delirium btw.

[u/Reimalken → u/foxy-coxy]

Gulden draak, chimay and so many other kinds of deliciousness.... But yeah, I'm sure I'd rather have a much more potent Budweiser 😂

Ok now I'm suddenly sad and miss being in Belgium 😭

[u/sambolino44]

What a strange hill to die on.

[u/Noodle_Dude_83 → u/sambolino44]

I never understand people who, despite dozens of people saying they are wrong, just carry on as if they're not the dumb one. It must be the rest of the world who are dumb. His arrogance is pretty astounding.

[u/sambolino44 → u/Noodle_Dude_83]

“Everybody is crazy except me and you, and I ain’t so sure about you!” LOL

[u/Tom0laSFW → u/Noodle_Dude_83]

Dunning Krueger

[u/Letos12thDuncan → u/Tom0laSFW]

What does the chick from National Treasure and Inglorious Basterds have to do with this?

[u/exexor → u/Letos12thDuncan]

That’s Diane Kruger. I think you mean Hubris.

[u/SirFarmerOfKarma → u/Noodle_Dude_83]

kind of like that crazy guy who said doctors should wash their hands

[u/LilMixelle]

The city of České Budějovice, the place of origin of the Budweiser Budvar Beer brand, has had the brewing rights since 1265, some 500 years before the country of the United States of America was even conceived. And funnily enough the brewery has carried the name Budweiser since at least the time when the Holy Roman empire was still around.

[u/Patrick_Epper_PhD → u/LilMixelle]

Hell, since the HRE was still more or less considered a significant power in Europe - not the agonic Frankenstein-like geopolitical abomination of the late 18th century.

[u/Real_MidGetz → u/Patrick_Epper_PhD]

Now I am become holy roman empire, destroyer of EU4 players’ intel I3 cpu

[u/ImpressiveBeyond8038 → u/LilMixelle]

Fun fact: the American brand 'Budweiser' was created by Herr Anheuser und Herr Busch, because they wanted to market a beer brewed in the Budvar style, just like most breweries in German speaking regions have marketed and still do market bitter lager beers as 'Pils', i.e. brewed in the Plzen style.

[u/leospeedleo → u/LilMixelle]

Here in Germany the oldest one is from 1040. didn’t think the US was around back then 😂

[u/MazDaShnoz → u/LilMixelle]

TIL

[u/vetruviusdeshotacon → u/LilMixelle]

America's entire existence as a nation can fit comfortably between that brewery's inception and Europe DISCOVERING the Americas lol

[u/RearAdmiralTaint]

The most American thing ever.

1: discover something the entire world has been doing for millennia

2: Claim you invented it

3: claim you’re the best at it.

[u/letmeseem → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

Steve Jobs was FANTASTIC at that. I remember when he introduced group SMSes like it was news and a crowd of journalists gave him a standing ovation, and everyone who didn't have an iPhone were like: WHAT? you COULDN'T send group SMSes?

[u/Sgt_Fox → u/letmeseem]

Like how I've had an SD card slot in my last several phones. Apple are currently using a terrible auto tune ad to show off that the phone has 2x storage space than it's last model

[u/Captain_Sterling → u/letmeseem]

When they created folders. 😁

[u/frizzykid → u/letmeseem]

This is kind of funny. I remember group messaging two close friends pre-smartphone era haha.

Whats even funnier about this is that apple didn't even make group messaging more convenient or easier, android was the one who eventually did that. For years group texting with Apple users was hell

[u/The1andonlygogoman64 → u/letmeseem]

they STILL do that.

[u/Quiet_Fan_7008 → u/letmeseem]

But Steve Jobs invented blue texts which everyone knows are far superior then green texts.

[u/BoredNBitchy → u/letmeseem]

I remember Apple trying to claim that android was ripping them off because they invented having a call, message, and internet button at the bottom of the screen.

My XDA pocket PC (that could make calls, so was technically a smartphone) had that, in 2004.

[u/Noodle_Dude_83 → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

And the twat is now commenting on this post making himself look like an even bigger twat.

[u/buffer_flush → u/Noodle_Dude_83]

Oh nice!

sorts by controversial

I’m going in.

[u/A_Sarcastic_Whoa → u/buffer_flush]

Godspeed 🫡

[u/RearAdmiralTaint → u/Noodle_Dude_83]

What a twat

[u/Cromasters → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

Funnily, America's craft beer scene sucked...until Jimmy Carter deregulated it. Prior to 1978 it was illegal to brew beer in your own home. Sam Adams and Sierra Nevada started as home brewers.

America also developed the Cascade Hop, which is used all over the world now for IPAs.

There's a lot of cool stuff developed in America. I don't know why people like OP have to go so crazy.

[u/cutezombiedoll → u/Cromasters]

There technically wasn’t a craft beer scene in the US before that. “Craft beer” was a term created to differentiate crappy macros from actually decent beer. Prior to prohibition, beer in the US was considered generally pretty damn good, so all beer was “craft” beer, prohibition shut down most of the smaller breweries, and WWII lead to the rise of “light beer” and beer made with corn and rice replacing much of the barley malt. Because of the restrictions on home-brewing and small scale brewing, the larger macros dominated the market and they realized they could cut costs by sticking with their “mostly corn and rice” recipes. Of course, by 1978 most Americans grew used to light beer so it took a long time for craft beer to even make a dent in total beer sales.

[u/cheeze_whiz_bomb → u/cutezombiedoll]

my understanding is that America had a sensational beer "culture" by the late 1800s that people from Europe would specifically travel to America to enjoy.  Regionally specific specialties , etc.  All from European immigrants, of course.

 Prohibition destroyed all of it, supposedly.  

 (I didn't actually 'know' this, but it is something a smart drinking buddy used to discuss. )

edit:  I agree with you on post-prohibition effects.  Our story was that it was only 10 years until WW2 changed things, and then we had the 50s ideas of mass production and consumption that destroyed anything good developing in American beer until maybe Jimmy Carter's home brewing changes. 

[u/RearAdmiralTaint → u/Cromasters]

Exactly, could have just said “we have a good micro brewery scene in the states” and everyone would agree and go on their way

[u/shophopper → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

As a European beer lover who’s been to the United States multiple times, I concur.

[u/MiamiDouchebag → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

and everyone would agree and go on their way

TBF the stereotype of American beer being really shitty is still common in Europe.

[u/TSP-FriendlyFire → u/MiamiDouchebag]

The American craft beer market tends to be pretty internal or even local. It's hard to find the good stuff even in Canada, I can't imagine exports are common in Europe, so all most Europeans are exposed to is the shitty mass produced stuff.

[u/mountainrebel → u/MiamiDouchebag]

That's probably because of the shitty macro brews we export. Good beer is really only produced and sold locally.

[u/sabotourAssociate → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

1. Brings up a brand that existed way before their watered down version.

[u/bellendhunter → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

I remember reading a comment on here about a young lady who didn’t realise US Independence Day isn’t celebrated around the world. I kinda get it, America is absolutely the centre of the world in America. Whereas I legitimately cannot go to the local shop without meeting someone from a different country.

[u/[deleted] → u/bellendhunter]

I was speaking to a US girl a few years ago, close to July 4th. She got really confused when I said I wasn't going to be doing anything to celebrate it. I'm British...

Then once I explained it to her, she then said 'oh, I guess it's still a bit of a sore point for you guys, right?' Lol, no. It's a meaningless day for us - the US was one of our many colonies. We lost it, which probably sucked at the time but we've kinda moved on now. We don't do that empire thing any more.

[u/Fluffiebunnie → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

The craft beer boom that took hold of Europe from the late 2000's/early 2010's started in US/Canada. So the OP Is not completely wrong.

[u/GODDAMNFOOL → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

I invented this new alcoholic drink by accidentally leaving a bottle of Welch's grape juice on the counter for 3 weeks. It doesn't taste great, but you should try it. Gets you pretty fucked up, more than beer!

[u/Bro-lapsedAnus → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

He also doesn't seems to be using "craft" in the right way anyway. Craft Breweries can make any style, it has nothing to with ABV.

With no context, it seems like the dude is bragging about Americans having stronger beer (who cares), because he only drinks IPAs and thinks that's what "craft beer" is.

[u/EarthMandy → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

This might be controversial to point out, but I was working in "real ale" pubs in the UK in the mid-noughties and at the time the craft beer revolution was absolutely inspired by the American microbrewery flavours of IPAs. Until then, 90% of British ales were bitters and milds drunk by bearded old men and pretentious teenagers like me, and you were lucky to find them in your average pub.

[u/scuba_GSO]

I believe that the entire country of Germany would like a word with this fool.

[u/Dilectus3010 → u/scuba_GSO]

Belgium aswell.

We have loads of beers starting at 6.5% and most are around 8.5%.

[u/Hi_Its_Salty → u/Dilectus3010]

My mom would nah me for having a (1) beer at home over the weekend.

Her argument ? It was 5% alcohol 😂

[u/DefNotReaves → u/Dilectus3010]

But that’s the thing, so does America haha

It’s just a dumb thing to argue about because most countries have all of these: good, bad, weak, strong… etc beer.

[u/Equivalent-Act-5202 → u/scuba_GSO]

But those german breweries are older than the country of Germany too, checkmate

[u/tenBusch → u/Equivalent-Act-5202]

to be fair, depending on your definition the current country of Germany is younger than a lot of people commenting on this thread

[u/AltruisticSalamander → u/tenBusch]

Hm, you mean following reunification? I guess that's true.

[u/Corrie7686]

The pub I had a beer in today has been there since 1155. Pied Bull Chester. They have a microbrewery, beer is excellent. They invented pies and bulls

[u/avg-bee-enjoyer]

This guy is an idiot, but don't sleep on American craft beer. Some of it is really very good.

[u/BeuteReinheit → u/avg-bee-enjoyer]

To expand on your thought - Prohibition is a huge factor in the evolution of brewing in America. There were major industrial type breweries but European immigrants were brewing all sorts of fantastic localized beers up until 1920. When prohibition hit only a small percentage of the larger breweries survived the 13 year ban on alcohol because they already had diversified into other beverages and products to utilize their distribution network, warehouses and refrigeration capabilities or they quickly pivoted into industries that could utilize existing capital. Soft drinks, n/a beers, malted milk for malt shops, straight malt syrup (which was used by lots of people to illegally brew their own beer at home), the list goes on. The biggest examples of American companies that survived until prohibition was lifted are all the breweries that we now associate with the generic American adjunct lager - Anheuser-Busch, Coors, Pabst, Miller, Yuengling, etc. Beer was plentiful again in the US post prohibition but it wasn't until Jimmy Carter passed a law in 1979 that legalized home brewing for the first time in about 50 years that sparked a renaissance in American brewing and effectively gave birth to what we now consider "craft beer". It's certainly a valid point that American brewing in the last 40ish years has pushed the definition of what beer can be further and faster than any other nation, but to state that Americans invented craft beer is lacking context.

[u/__KptnHaddock]

Americans boasting about being the inventors of stuff that has been around for thousands of years is the funniest thing to me

[u/IlIlllIlllIlIIllI]

Budweiser literally stole their name from a Czech town famous for brewing beer https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budweiser_Budvar_Brewery

[u/BroTheDonut]

13th century monks are like WTF!

[u/ThirdHairyLime → u/BroTheDonut]

More like Ancient Mesopotamians are like wtf.

[u/watermelonspanker]

Craft beer is one of the first things humanity produced.

[u/ImhotepsServant → u/watermelonspanker]

It may be one of the reasons most cultures aren’t nomadic.

[u/ShotgunFuneral13]

This comment brought to you by the USA-centric model of the universe

[u/WesCoastBlu]

Does dude think the I in IPA stands for Indiana?!!

[u/JamBandDad → u/WesCoastBlu]

Nah it stands for “it’s pretty American”

[u/Many-Application1297]

Even Tennents (Scotland) dates back 450 years at the Wellpark Brewery spot.

And that’s hardly a craft beer!

[u/Strange-Bed9518]

Budweiser is from two different beer breweries, worldwide. It’s not one and the same.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budweiser_trademark_dispute

[u/EduinBrutus → u/Strange-Bed9518]

Anheiser Busch cannot even legally use the name Budweiser in the EU. It has to be called "Bud".

[u/trevorgoodchyld]

That’s just such a stupid thing to say

[u/saxovtsmike]

stiegl Brewery in Austria was founded 1492

[u/Cirill_Levitsky]

Did you know that America invented Big Bang?

[u/Quetzacoatel → u/Cirill_Levitsky]

It's called "The Manhattan Project".

[u/Only_One_Kenobi]

Have you ever heard of Belgium? The country that bloody Unesco classified their craft beer as a world heritage?

[u/Spare-Half796]

Maybe I’m miss understanding this but are they trying to claim Budweiser is a good beer?

That is literally one of the worst beers I’ve ever had

[u/htx_2_0_2_3 → u/Spare-Half796]

They're not, they're trying to dispel the notion that American beer = Budweiser since it's a multinational company.

Every country has its own Budweiser

[u/The-WiXXer → u/Spare-Half796]

Are you talking about shitty american so called "Budweiser" or about the traditonal Budweiser Budvar from the town of Budweis in the Czech Republic???

[u/Polar-Ice → u/The-WiXXer]

It's only called Budweiser if it's from the Budweis region of the Czech Republic, otherwise it's just sparkling hop juice.

[u/RearAdmiralTaint → u/The-WiXXer]

lol take a guess

[u/C0RDE_ → u/[deleted]]

That poor man. I can only hope his apology letter from the president is in the post.

[u/DefNotReaves → u/Spare-Half796]

Considering they’re talking about craft breweries: no, I don’t think they’re talking about Bud.

[u/RearAdmiralTaint → u/Spare-Half796]

Is it even beer? Budweiser is like drinking fizzy water while someone outside shouts “beer”

[u/MontanaHonky → u/RearAdmiralTaint]

People will say this while drinking a beer that is the same percentage of alcohol as bud

[u/Dev_012]

Affligem is Belgian beer from 1074

[u/wowbragger]

Just remember, it's all for the love of the beer. No matter where you're at.

Really loved living in Europe and getting to experience so many great beers.

In my observance, a number of skilled German Brewmeister have taken time to work with some of their US compatriots. There is indeed some really cool things happening in the US beer industry, and stagnation gets boring.

[u/No-Clerk-6804]

Beer has been around since the Egyptians 3000BC, but sure.

[u/QueenOfQuok]

We call it "craft beer" in response to the type of beer production that led us to forget that all beer was once craft beer. It's like calling a chair "hand-carved" or a handwoven fabric "homespun" or any small goods "artisanal". Once upon a time that didn't need to be specified.

[u/FreyaTheSlayyyer]

Isn’t most beer like 6%+? At least that’s all the beer that I’ve seen

[u/U-47]

Laughs in Belgian.

[u/DumbFucking_throaway]

America is the entire western hemisphere, for all we know that could be true.

[u/CPTBartender99]

Orval (Belgian beer) is a beer that dates back to 1070 and is still made in a temple by monks today. It's alcohol percentage is also 6+. You making yourself sound stupid here man come on now.

[u/roylien]

Budweiser originated from my country, it’s from town called České Budějovice. It was there before Columbus even went to America lol

[u/Baldbeagle73]

Laughs in Sumerian.

[u/Elegant-Campaign-572]

Australia would like to send the gentlemen a case of Foster's. Not because it's new or old...just for punishment!

[u/Wrong_Maintenance540]

American beer? Oh, you mean tap water! laughs in German

[u/AlexRodgerzzz]

I'm sorry Americans but the level of denial most of you guys have for anything outside of your "Great" Nation is truly mind boggling

[u/documentiron → u/AlexRodgerzzz]

You guys signal boost these loud fools and suddenly it becomes most?